no degree impedes climbing the ladder, was Re: mysql issue

Jason Hall jayce at
Thu Feb 9 09:45:11 MST 2012

And they pay that much, because that's what you're willing to accept.
I know them well, old friends :)

But if you're skills are good enough, there are plenty of other places
that pay better. All depends on how well you know your stuff.

On Thu, Feb 9, 2012 at 9:39 AM, Jason Van Patten <jason at> wrote:
> On 2/9/2012 9:22 AM, Steve Alligood wrote:
>> On 2/8/12 5:03 PM, Jason Van Patten wrote:
>>> Sorry my knee jerk reaction is to assume i'm being criticized. Working
>>> this industry with no degree means i get paid crap relatively speaking
>>> and am constantly on the defensive. Can we just say i was giving you a
>>> good old southern "TESTIFY BROTHER!"?
>>> Jason
>> That's interesting.
>> You find that having no degree still impedes your rise up the ladder?
>> I find this topic fascinating, because I think it is entirely
>> dependent on the shop, often to the shop's detriment.
>> I have been doing sysadmin work for 15 years now, and most of the
>> shops I have worked for have ended up with several dozen admins, most
>> of whom do not have degrees.  In fact, usually only about 10% have
>> degrees, and those shops have paid fairly well to anyone with the
>> skills and can-do attitude, and do not care about that
>> not-quite-worthless paper.
>> I have also worked with several shops that think the degree is more
>> important than the ability/experience of the admin.  They tend to be
>> really large companies with really large bureaucracies, and usually
>> have a very mediocre admin staff, with one or two good admins that
>> carry the team.
>> There are limited options in those shops.  As I see them, they are 1)
>> go to your manager and have a frank discussion about what you need to
>> do to get the raises, then do it.  Sometimes this even works, though
>> usually at the 5% annual raises.  2) stay quiet and do what you
>> currently do and stay at what you are at.  This is sometimes the best
>> if you need specific benefits, or your skills are specific to the
>> company you are at.  3) go looking and see if you can convince someone
>> else that you are worth more.  It is a hard market right now for
>> companies to find good talent, so it may be a good time to shop around.
>> All three options suck in their own way.  I wish you luck on whichever
>> you choose.
>> -Steve
> I've been doing mostly programming work for about 8 years mostly perl,
> sql and javascript now and only making 16.50 an hour. I have a big
> deficiency in design skills, but i can crank out an api in a day or less
> and i can read just about any c based programming language some better
> than others. I love ajax and json work but my current employer wants old
> school page redirects and gets cranky when i use hash switches, even
> when i put in notes to explain what i'm doing. the company i worked for
> before this got hit hard by the recession so it cut 75% of it's staff me
> along with it. They asked me to come back the next week but the wife was
> pretty bitter. Been looking for work in Utah county but i'm not finding
> it. If you have any suggestions on places looking for programmers and
> willing to get me off welfare i'm all ears.
> Jason
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