Daniel C. dcrookston at
Tue Mar 14 09:19:58 MST 2006

On 3/14/06, Wade Preston Shearer <lists at> wrote:
> That's a pain. Why force the user to have to right click and copy-n-
> paste simply to bookmark the site or to retrieve the URL to send to
> someone? Also, my browser history only shows one URL for all of the
> pages that I have visited on that site.
> What are the benefits that you feel frames give that cannot be
> accomplished with scrollable divs?

The benefit imparted by frames here is that you're able to browse the
thread list at the same time as you're reading any particular thread. 
phpBB makes you go into a thread, read through it, back out of the
thread to the list,  etc.  I feel like a mole crawling down the tunnel
of a thread, blind to what's behind me.  Clicking the link (or the
back button) to return to the thread list feels like walking
backwards.  I want to jump instantly from one thread to another - and
I want to do it *without* waiting for a huge page to load.

I also want to be able to refresh the list of threads (to see if there
are any new posts to me, of high interest, etc.) quickly and without
moving away from the thread I'm on.  Often times I'll be reading a
thread that's moderately interesting while waiting for someone to
respond to a question I posted in another thread.  With the thread
list in a separate frame I can refresh it occasionally without leaving
my spot in the current thread.

I suppose you could do all that with Ajax, but then what happens when
the person has javascript turned off?  Maybe Ajax is a lesser sin than
frames, but it seems like it's 50/50 to me.

AND, like I said before, Beehive provides a way to browse it with no
frames or javascript.

As far as it's being annoying to have to copy and paste the URL -
you're going to have to copy and paste it out of the address bar if
you're sending it to someone anyway, aren't you?

I have never run into an instance when I wanted to bookmark a
particular thread.  Occasionally I've thought "Oh, this is interesting
but I don't have time to read it now, I will when I get home."  When
that happens, I'll mark the thread as "high interest".  Then when I
get home I log back into the forum, call up the list of "high interest
with posts today" threads, and find the one I was reading.  Maybe this
is just a workaround for the unable-to-bookmark-easily problem, but
I've never really thought of it that way.

Anyway - I recognize that using frames has drawbacks.  But I feel that
in this case their use is justified.  If there's another way to enable
browsing the thread list without reloading the entire page (and
prefferably without using ajax, but whatever) then by all means
suggest it.

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