Did Ed Snowden do the right thing?
ryanbyrd at gmail.com
Mon Jun 10 23:13:28 MDT 2013
please consider the following as irrefutable evidence:
mormons live longer:
horses prefer prefer peppermint to oregano:
Religious people are less depressed, less anxious and less suicidal than
73.6% of statistics are made up on the spot:
Atheist headstone inscription: "All Dressed Up And Nowhere To Go".
On Mon, Jun 10, 2013 at 10:59 PM, Joshua Marsh <joshua at themarshians.com>wrote:
> On Mon, Jun 10, 2013 at 7:28 PM, Nicholas Leippe <nick at leippe.com> wrote:
> > Defend the implication that the LDS church receives no gain from its
> > membership. Last I knew its coffers were pretty full. The remuneration
> > ward from Salt Lake for financial aid of its local members is also
> > frequently quite inequitable. There are wards collecting $100k+ each
> > in tithing, sending it all to Salt Lake, and being allocated mere $1000s
> > it in return--insufficient to help all the needy families in their own
> > ward.
> That is an extremely misguided view of what Tithing is used for, how it
> differs from fast offerings, and what the actual figures really are. If
> they were simply paying tithing so the youth could go to camp during the
> summer, you'd have a point. If tithing was used for helping needy families,
> you'd be right. Neither of those are the case, so I can only assume you
> haven't studied it well enough to make a cogent argument.
> > Also, you must both qualify and quantify "such joy in their hearts". Esp.
> > re the fact that Utah is the state with the highest use of
> > per capita. That's not a coincidence or simply correlation without
> > causation.
> Have you ever considered it might be the other half of the Utah population
> that is taking the anti-depressants because they are forced to live in Zion
> with the Mormons? The anti-depressant thing doesn't make complete sense to
> me since there are other studies that show Religious people are happier in
> general. What it boils down to for me is that you can find a study or a
> figure to support any position you want. So, why be so antagonistic toward
> someone who has found his place in this world where you haven't.
> > In defense of Sasha's position, I will qualify that there do exist
> > pockets of micro-cultures among the LDS church. *Some* of them, function
> > altruistically and to the mutual benefit of all. Something Sasha may have
> > not experienced yet is some of the other micro cultures that
> > of which I have personally experienced, and others which have been
> > recounted to me first hand, which do not function in the idyllic fashion
> > Sasha has experienced. To head off objection from Sasha, these other
> > cultures in no way violate the principles that the church espouses--they
> > are right in line with the general handbook of instruction also--you
> > say they are apostate wards or anything and dismiss them or the effects
> > they have on their members--they must be included in the equation.
> This isn't much different than any other social group though. In any large
> social group, norms can be diluted at local levels. What may be considered
> "right in line with the general handbook of instructions" is up to
> interpretation by the relative understanding of the people at the local
> level. If those local interpretations sufficiently deviate from the larger
> group, then the rest of the group must me made aware to bring the lesser
> group in line with the whole or have the group removed. This has been
> studied by sociologists well before the LDS church was around. I'm sure
> you'll find that most of your in-groups will have similar issues.
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> Don't fear the penguin.
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