Hosting

Grant Shipley gshipley at gmail.com
Thu Dec 12 11:28:19 MST 2013


On Thu, Dec 12, 2013 at 11:26 AM, S. Dale Morrey <sdalemorrey at gmail.com>wrote:

> See I would call them omewhere between IaaS and SaaS.
> yes there is software you can use to interact with them, but by that
> measure so is EC2, you can control it from the AWS Management Console, plus
> you can always use SSH.
> On the otherhand you can interact exclusively through the APIs as well.
>

Very good point.  I may have to rethink how I lump it in.

--
gs

>
>
> On Thu, Dec 12, 2013 at 10:21 AM, Grant Shipley <gshipley at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> > I would actually lump S3 and Glacier under SaaS.  Its a service thats
> > provided for you with software on the backend to manage it all.  All S3
> and
> > Glacier really are is a set of up API(s) you can use to access the
> service.
> >
> >
> > On Thu, Dec 12, 2013 at 11:14 AM, S. Dale Morrey <sdalemorrey at gmail.com
> > >wrote:
> >
> > > Don't forget Storage as a Service, S3 & Glacier for example.  That
> > doesn't
> > > really fall under your categories as far as I can tell.
> > >
> > >
> > > On Thu, Dec 12, 2013 at 10:08 AM, Grant Shipley <gshipley at gmail.com>
> > > wrote:
> > >
> > > > Let's clear up what cloud actually means then.  There are three types
> > of
> > > > cloud computing:
> > > >
> > > > IaaS - Infrastructure as a service
> > > >
> > > > Think Amazon EC2, Google Compute Engine here.  The only thing
> provided
> > to
> > > > the user is the hardware / vm.  The user is responsible for providing
> > the
> > > > operating system, updating it, apply security errata, installing and
> > > > managing all applications, tuning the OS - databases - application
> > > servers
> > > > etc.  It addresses a real concern in the industry by reducing the
> time
> > to
> > > > market for getting servers quickly.  With IaaS, you can spin up 1000
> > > > machines in a matter of minutes and grow as demand quires it.  The
> only
> > > > problem, no one knows what their final bill will be every month.
> > > >
> > > > You have to bring your sys admins, application code, and users along
> > with
> > > > you.
> > > >
> > > > PaaS - Platform as a service
> > > >
> > > > The OpenShift, Heroku, CloudFoundry here.  PaaS sits on top of IaaS
> to
> > > > automate even more of the environment.  Typically the PaaS will
> manage
> > > all
> > > > aspects of the environment for you.  This includes database tuning,
> > > > automatic scaling, application server management, security updates to
> > OS
> > > > and runtimes, etc.  Users of PaaS need to deploy and be responsible
> for
> > > the
> > > > application code that is deployed on the environment to ensure it is
> > > > robust, scalable, and cloud friendly.
> > > >
> > > > You have to bring your application code and users along with you.
> > > >
> > > > SaaS - Software as a Service
> > > >
> > > > Think salesforce.com, facebook, gmail, dropbox here.  Software as a
> > > > service
> > > > is a WYSIWG environment.  The platform manages everything for you and
> > > often
> > > > times you can't customize the application code.  This is the cloud
> > > > technology that has been around the longest and widely adopted.
> > > >
> > > > You have to bring your users and your data to the table here.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > The adoption rate among these three cloud technologies are as
> follows:
> > > > SaaS - Huge adoption.  This was a buzz word 8 years ago and we really
> > > don't
> > > > hear much about it anymore because its widely accepted and in use by
> > 99%
> > > of
> > > > all corporations today.
> > > >
> > > > IaaS - medium adoption. People still have concerns about moving their
> > > > workloads to a public cloud provider (ec2) but a lot of people are
> > making
> > > > this move.  When I talk about cloud computing to companies, one of
> the
> > > > first things I hear is -- we can't put our users email address and
> data
> > > in
> > > > a public cloud.  Our data is so important we need a 5 million dollar
> > > oracle
> > > > RAC server behind 15 firewalls. I think ask them what they use for
> > sales
> > > > automation tools.  They proudly respond with Salesforce.com.  Face ->
> > > Palm.
> > > >  People don't realize that they are storing much more than users data
> > in
> > > > the public cloud today.  With SF.com they are storing all of their
> > > > financials and forecasts.  Having access to someone sf.comenvironment
> > > is
> > > > more damning that having access to their internal oracle db.
> > > >
> > > > PaaS - low adoption.  This is the new kid on the block.  I fully
> expect
> > > > this to be mainstream and every developer will be using a PaaS in 3-5
> > > years
> > > > as they see the benefits for development.  The tidal wave is coming.
> > >  It's
> > > > best for us developers to go ahead and get familiar with it because
> it
> > is
> > > > coming!
> > > >
> > > > Now, just to be clear.  You will hear a lot of other crap about cloud
> > > > computing.  IMO ignore it.  People and companies will tout things
> such
> > as
> > > > mBaaS (Mobile backend as a service) MWaaS (Middle Ware as a Service)
> > etc.
> > > >  All of these new buzz word terms can be recognized in one of three
> > main
> > > > categories (IaaS, PaaS, SaaS).  I don't know why people are clinging
> to
> > > and
> > > > making up new as a services acronyms.  It just further confuses
> > everyone
> > > > knew to cloud computing and is hindering the adoption of this
> fantastic
> > > > technology.
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > gs
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > On Thu, Dec 12, 2013 at 10:29 AM, Jason Klebs <jasonk at riseup.net>
> > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > In my opinion, 'the cloud' is a buzz-word, and regarding it, people
> > act
> > > > > accordingly.  Buzz-words are meant to diminish understanding of
> > > > > something, not enhance it.  Therefore, a lot of places don't weigh
> > the
> > > > > benefits and drawbacks of what is essentially a move to another
> > hosting
> > > > > provider.
> > > > >
> > > > > While we're opening up cans of worms...
> > > > > I have assumed (even pre-Snowden) that every EC2 instance comes
> with
> > > > > root access for the NSA built-in.  Thoughts on this?
> > > > >
> > > > > -Jason
> > > > >
> > > > > On 12/12/2013 10:21 AM, Jonathan Duncan wrote:
> > > > > > On Thu, Dec 12, 2013 at 8:03 AM, S. Dale Morrey <
> > > sdalemorrey at gmail.com
> > > > > >wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > >> For the most part, you can't just migrate existing systems to
> "the
> > > > > >> cloud(tm)".  You really do need to think of it as a
> > > re-implementation
> > > > > task
> > > > > >> and expect your costs to follow accordingly.
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >> Agreed. The Cloud is just another tool. Like any tool, if used
> > > > properly
> > > > > > can be helpful, if used improperly can be deadly. The company I
> am
> > > > > > currently with is in the process of migrating all services to the
> > > > cloud.
> > > > > > This includes an entire rewrite of the code base and entirely new
> > > > system
> > > > > > architecture. It is a mistake to think of the Cloud in the same
> way
> > > as
> > > > > one
> > > > > > would think of traditional physical servers. For me, learning to
> > use
> > > > the
> > > > > > Cloud effectively has required me to adopt a new paradigm.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > /*
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